Dear Fellow Pensioners
MoD letter dated 17 Oct 2018 lays out the Concordance Tables running into 217 pages. the letter is available in this post and may be downloaded from here The tables cover all ranks and categories of Army, Navy and Air Force, giving scales in Chart Form for 5th 6th and 7th CPCs.
The social media has been flooded by the Veterans on the same and we have received hundreds of queries on the effect of these tables, hence this post for the information of all is being hosted.
The tables pertaining to Regular officers from Lt upwards have been extracted and can be downloaded by clicking here . The tables give the corresponding NOTIONAL pays of 5th, 6th and 7th CPCs . As such knowing the last pay drawn by you at the time of retirement and comparing horizontally will give you Notional Pay under the 7th CPC, 50% of which, will be your basic pension. add to this the 50% of MSP of 7CPC.
The Implementation letter of the 7th CPC scales was issued by MoD on 05 Sep 2017 and had given out a method of calculating the pension at Annx 1 for officers, JCOs and ORs. You can download this letter by clicking here . Since May 2017 we have posted several times the impact of Notional Method for Pension Fixation in various blog posts as under :-
(a). 7 CPC - PENSIONES GAIN OR NO GAIN - https://signals-parivaar.blogspot.com/2017/03/page.html
(b) 7th CPC IMPLEMENTATION 2016 - ALL IN ONE DETAILS - http://signals-parivaar.blogspot.in/2017/03/7th-cpc-implementation.html
(c) NOTIONAL METHOD OF PAY FIXATION RTI BY AIR MARSHAL SY SAVUR - https://signals-parivaar.blogspot.com/2018/02/notional.html
We had calculated some examples in the above posts.
WITHOUT GOING INTO FURTHER DETAILS IT SUFFICES TO STATE THAT THOSE OF US WHO HAVE RECEIVED OROP WEF 01 JUL 2014 WILL CONTINUE TO GET THE OROP X 2.57 , WHILE THOSE WHO RETIRED ON OR AFTER 01 JAN 2014 WILL BE BENEFITED BY THE NOTIONAL METHOD OF FIXATION.
However, those who retired in 2013 are of two categories those who earned pension above the OROP - they will continue to get pension as fixed vide their PPOs based on the last pay drawn and will be benefited by the notional method of fixation, the second category are those who got pension less than the OROP for the rank and service - their pension would have been enhanced to OROP wef 01 Jul 2014 as such they will not be benefited by the said NOTIONAL method under 7th CPC.
THE ABOVE STATEMENTS CAN BE CHECKED and VERIFIED FROM THE EARLIER POSTS OR BY RE-CALCULATING STARTING WITH YOUR LAST PAY DRAWN AS GIVEN IN YOUR ORIGINAL PPO.
SOME OF THE EARLIER REPLIES AND OUR COMMENTS
BRIGADIERS -- See table at page 194 for Brigs.
Say the last pay 18500+450 (Rank pay is not considered as taken into acct while drawing out the Tables) as in PPO under 5th CPC . Look against it under notional pay under 7th CPC it is 148100. Means 74050 will be the pension by this method, add to it the half of the MSP 15500/2 which makes it approx 82000.
Brigs 30 yrs and above are already getting 37570×2.57 = 96555 which is the higher among the two (82000 and 96555) hence it doesn't effect the pers who got OROP.
LT GENERALS
As I had already predicted last year in our blog post that the Notional Method of Pay Fixn will
not apply to us, the Fauji’s, since our basic pension IN HAND as on 31 Dec 2015 multiplied by 2.57 will
be more than notional fixation. Thanks to Modi Ji that we got the OROP which placed us above others.
3. I am giving the calculations and also attaching the OROP Tables as well as the Concordance Table. Your scale was 22400-525-24500 as Lt Gen and you retired at its max ie
24500 as such your basic pension was 12250/- under 5th CPC
4. Under 6th CPC it was finally fixed at 36500 vide PCDA Circular No 500,
. On grant of OROP you should have got 39500 (40000 in case HAG+).
5. 36500 under 6 CPC meant that the pay amounted to 73000/- since
pension is 50%.
6. Plz look up 73000/- under 6th CPC in concordance table – it gives
correspondingly Notional pay as 187700/- hence pension half of it 93850/-. Now
let us compare it with your OROP X 2.57 i.e 39500*2.57=101515 which is more
than Notional Pay Fixn.
7. Hence your pension will continue to be as it is. It further confirms that NONE of the uniformed
person who retired before 01 Jan 2014 will be benefited by the Notional Pay Fixn method, however those retired after Dec 2013 will be benefited, they had Nil OROP but their pension had been more than OROP scales..
ONCE YOU WORK OUT FOR YOUR RANK PLEASE SHARE ON THIS POST BY MAILING IT TO
NB -- IN CASE OF ANY OBSERVATIONS KINDLY PLACE THE SAME UNDER COMMENTS WITH YOUR RANK, NAME AND EMAIL ID, SO THAT WE CAN RESPOND TO YOU INDIVIDUALLY.
For impact on our pensions tap -- http://bit.ly/2PKXywa
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************** PLEASE DO WRITE TO US **************
WE WHOLE HEART IDLY WELCOME YOUR COMMENTS , QUERIES, REMARKS AND SUGGESTIONS ONCE THESE ARE PLACED UNDER THE COMMENTS BELOW.
1. Kindly post your remarks under the comments below ending the same with your RANK , NAME and YOUR MAIL ID. Comments posted without your identification, we are sorry, will not be published.
2. Please avoid emailing us unless you have first gone through the post in detail and have worked out the solution on your own.
3. We regret that we have no infrastructure to take on individual tasks on their behalf. Please do not embarrass us by offering donations etc to work for you, we have no commercial leanings.
4. Our aim at Signals Parivaar is to guide so that you can work on it as a "DO IT YOURSELF" exercise. Ours is a "NISHKAAM SEWA" to our Community.
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ब्रिगेडियर_नरेन्द्र_ढंड
Brig Narinder Dhand,
Founder & Convener
Veteran's Web Portals.
Brig Narinder Dhand,
Founder & Convener
Veteran's Web Portals.
NOTE - Do Join our Email List - Please email your Rank and Name, Regt/Corps , Email ID and Mob Number to our Managing Member at " mgr.sigs@gmail.com " for Registration to receive updates on Veteran's issues regularly.
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Sir
ReplyDeleteWith all due respect would like to say that you are uploading the information/materials only concerned to retired officers. How much it would be good and helpful for retired PBOR also if you could provide/share the valuable information which is concerned to both retired officers and PBOR on your blogs. I would highly appreciate your consideration.
Thanks and best regards.
ALL YOU ARE DOING IS PRAISE WORTHY.
ReplyDeleteHOWEVER, MORE IMPORTANT THAN MONEY IS TO HAVE IN YOUR POCKET THE PASS CALLED ECHS CARD TO FEEL SECURE. Without it you are no body.
I HAVE ALREADY RAISED THE POINT; FOR MONTHS YOU DO NOT KNOW THE FATE OF YOUR ONLINE APPLICATION FOR RENEWED CARD. echs HQ, Lodi Clinic or Sta HQ are clueless
WHY TO BLAME MOD . THE AG BRANCH CAN COORDINATE WITH ECHS HQ.
Some message comes from Infosyss demanding reference number which was never given at the time of sending application.
ic 6533 Maj Gen Satish Chandra ; satishjalota@gmail.com
m
Can we get your e mails and articles etc regularly? If yes please incl me for the same. My details Lt Col Ranjan Bakshi,ic-16686,settled in Dehradun. Retired on 01 nov 1995 on superannuation.E mail ID rbronbox@gmail.com
ReplyDeleteSir,
ReplyDeleteRegarding AG's MP5&6 WEBSITE LAUNCHED, Many have uploaded their data but some veterans have asked be doubts as whether they have to send a signed hard copy by post also? I had written to them (by e-mail given in the web site), there seems to be no response. May I seek clarification as to is there a requirement to submit a signed hard copy apart from having uploaded the info on the web site please
Regards
Col. Srikantha, Bangalore, 9886987997, mail id:col.s.srikantha@gmail.com
Lt Col JP Narain, coljpn@gmail.com. Sir in table 4 for Lt Col (TS) in 6 CPC scale wef 2006 to 2015 it is mention PB 3 whereas on the right side it is given that rank abolished in 2004, is not understood though, the band and grade was the same for both the ranks ie TS/SG since the rank(TS) was abolished in 2004. The letter issued on the issue after the correction in 2008/9 also did not mention any such difference and both were given same band and grade but now in table 4 and 5, a difference has been created of PB3/4. Maybe some wise person can note and clarify why this discrimination has been created suddenly post dated after so many yrs of the order of 6 CPC.
ReplyDeleteI have been given to understand that there is no need to send hard copies to MP 5&6.
ReplyDeleteIn the case of older retirees in ranks which are now time-bound, e.g. Lt Col / Cdr / Wg Cdr, the method of fixation of the, so called, "notional pay" could be anomalous and discriminatory as the calculation ignores the crucial element of "qualifying service".
ReplyDeleteIf the "notional pay" of an older retiree ( say, pre Dec 2004 Lt Col) with x years of QS is fixed at par with "notional pay" of a post Jan 2006 retiree with, say, (x-5) years of QS in the same rank then the whole method needs to be re-examined as it runs counter to the very principles of equity and parity repeatedly cited in 7 CPC Report.
My views on the matter : https://goo.gl/zYoRjf
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteDear Fellow Veterans,
ReplyDeleteWe thank you for your comments/remarks and observations.
our response is as under :-
Gurmukh - Wish you had given your Rank as well, so that I could have appropriately addressed you, any way since this post is being read all over and we have so many JCOs and ORs on my mailing list incl from Navy and Air Force, called as "BHARTYA SENA EK PARIVAAR", I must address your concern as well. Do look up earlier posts while OROP and 6th CPC fixn had created confusion, there have been large number of posts concerning other than officers. You may not be aware that on this site we rely mostly on experts and the contributions sent by veterans, which we share with you all. We are thus in urgent need of a JCO or NCO who can take on this task of working out the intended post in any language. Some ex records pers joined us but soon left and went into hiding. They have their own priorities and may not be having time to do this voluntary and painful job.
As and when we have some one in our team, we will be much happy to share information with our valiant JCOs and Jawans...
Gen Satish - Sir, you are right, have you checked the status of your ECHS application on line, there may have been some problem in verification of your data. Since you stay very close to AG's RK Puram office, pl go over to MP 5 & 6 and check whether they have already verified your ECHS application and accepted.
Col Ranjan - Welcome to our mailing list "OUR BIGGER FAMILY" you will get all updates. Do ask your friends also to join the mailing list by sending their Rank & Name Arm/Svc, email ID, mob number and the City residing to mgr.sigs@gmail.com to incl them in the mailing list. There are no spams or faltoo mails at-all on our bigger family mails, which is being ensured by using Auto e-filters at the server. The mailing list has grown to over 1987 members who get instant updates. We are proud that our updates go to over 6000 mail IDs of veterans in India and Abroad instantly.
Col Sri - The option to send signed copy is only to generate the LPC by PCDA (O). hence no need for us who have no change in their LPC
Lt Col Narain - The table for Lt Col (TS) is for offrs who retired before 16/12/2004 as Lt Col (TS) however those Lt Cols who retired after this date should refer to the next table for LT COLS with nothing in the bracket as TS or SEL. You are right the all Lt Cols under 6 CPC ended with basic pension of 26260/-
IN CASE YOU ARE COMMENTING ON ANY OTHER SUBJECT, THAN THIS POST KINDLY PLACE YOUR COMMENT UNDER RELEVANT POST ONLY.
Best wishes
Brig Narinder Dhand
Thanks for inputs the write up is simple and easy to follow in case of Retired Brigadiers and Lt Gens.Similar write up for others will be helpful.
ReplyDeleteBrig Dharam Prakash,Veteran
Sir,
ReplyDeleteI am an ex MNS officer having taken PMR in Jan 2009, after serving for 26 years months.
W
How will My pension effected by the new notification ?
Lt Col JP Narain, coljpn@gmail.com. sir pl ref to my earlier comment on the post and thanks for ur reply. You are right but the question is the band and the grades started only in 6 CPC where both the ranks were brought at par and the rank of Lt Col(TS) was abolished then this remark becomes irrelevant then what the purpose of this remark here and creates a doubt and hope our bureaucrats are not planning something funny for the presently serving Lt Cols on the equation front with the civ in the AHQ since there was no such remark given in the letter/tables of 2009 where the Lt Col rank was upgraded to Band 4.
ReplyDeleteBrig Dhand Sir,
ReplyDeleteI am thoroughly impressed by work you are doing for Veteran Community. The blog is always up to date. Thank you 'Teevr Choukas'! Warm regards
Lt Col Dutt. After Rank Pay Restoration, the Corr PPOs of Pre-1996 and Pre-2006 Officer Retirees, were issued to show Last Pay Drawn as Basic plus Rank Pay around Year 2015. In these Concordance Tables, Rank Pay is again NOT included, though it claims that it is included in 7th CPC. ONCE BITTEN, TWICE SHY.
ReplyDeleteIt'll be worthwhile going into it.
Sir
ReplyDeleteMy pt is that OROP pension will be higher than Notional method then why govt issued this letter.It must have clarified in applicability because pre 13 are getting OROP pension.
Concordance table for Hony Lt and equivalents show that their pay during 6 cpc from 1.1.2006 to 31.12.2015 is ₹ 19530+GP 5400=24930.
ReplyDeleteHowever, the bitter truth is the pay on promotion to Hony Lt was fixed at the lowest rate of PB3 ie ₹15600 or one increment more than the last rank held as SM and equivalents whichever was more. It never equalled to ₹19530 and was much lesser than that.
If last pay drawn in 6 cpc is considered for Notional pay fixation in 7 cpc as per this concordance table, none will be benefitted. The concept of pay during 6cpc as shown in the concordance table is either fallacious or farce and beyond any truth.
No such instructions are available to show that Hony Lts and equivalents pay is to be fixed as ₹19530 for post 1.1.2006 promotees after 6 cpc.
Lt Col Dutt. It is correct to say that after SC Ruling, the Corr PPOs in respect of 4th and 5th CPC Regime Officer Retirees upto Rank of Brig, were issued around 2015 and showed their Basic Pension inclusive of Rank Pay.The MOD has again played the old Trick and omitted our Rank Pay at the Starting Point and a foot-note says that it is taken into account for 7th CPC in these tables. Air Marshal Savur's Concordance Tables were correctly made and the Difference is for all to see. TRIPAS had also commented so in their remarks. None has raised this point otherwise. Let my Veteran Colleagues be cautioned that 'a burnt child dreads the fire and once bitten twice shy.'Let some enlightened friend work it out and advise. colonel.dutt@gmail.com
ReplyDeleteGood job Sir 👍Keep it up💝
ReplyDeleteLt Gen J S Dhillon,VSM
D.O.C. 15 Mar 1970 -SS8(NT)
D.O.R. 31 Oct 2018
Rgds
Dear Sir, As to why the regular commissioned Capts retired with 30 Yrs of QS are getting same rate of OROP that of the HCO Captains with same length of service?. Is the no other method so that these officers may get their due pension as per GOI letter 07 Nov 2015.
ReplyDelete